[Radiance-general] RE : Light Shelf Reflections

Shamim Javed javeds2006 at gmail.com
Fri Mar 15 08:17:59 PDT 2013 

Andy,

Pictures from my model:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/xz5glrx34o4cucz/LS%20Ref_Model%20Pic_14mar.pdf
They do validate your simulation results.

I tried to replicate your simulation image (using Radiance via Ecotect) but
without success so far.  I used the Radiance Control Panel in Ecotect
to insert the values you had used for your simulation but continue to get
my previous picture. How long did your image take to generate?

Shamim.


On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 11:10 PM, Andrew McNeil <amcneil at lbl.gov> wrote:

> My result is much different.  With gray walls, perfect mirror floor and
> ceiling and using a time of 11.75 for the sky my rendering looks like this:
> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16523492/test.tif
> (cool infinity box effect!)
>
> Here is the model that I use (which is just your model modified as I had
> suggested):
> http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16523492/Test.zip
>
> And these are the commands I use:
> oconv mirror_s.rad mirror_s_sky.rad > test.oct
>
> rvu -vth -vp 9.628 4.564 6.510 -vd -1.701 0.360 -0.007 -vu 0 0 1 -vh 180
> -vv 180 -vs 0 -vl 0 -dr 20 -lr 20 -ps 1 -ab 3 test.oct
>
> maybe you can spot the difference between what I'm doing and what you're
> doing?
>
> Andy
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 7:45 PM, Shamim Javed <javeds2006 at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> I tried the suggestions but could not get to the anticipated outcome.
>>  See results:
>>
>> https://www.dropbox.com/s/hyr4i0dylr7htzp/SJ_Light%20Shelf%20Reflections_Gray%20Walls.pdf
>>
>> Any other thoughts most welcome!
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 8:34 PM, Andrew McNeil <amcneil at lbl.gov> wrote:
>>
>>> Are you expecting to see them in your rendering?  This will not be the
>>> case in the way that you set up your model.  The light will not be visible
>>> on a perfect mirror because all light is reflected in the mirror direction
>>> - none to the view point.  And all your walls are perfectly absorbing so
>>> you won't see any light patterns on those either.  Your view will only show
>>> reflection of the perfectly black walls.  The multiple reflections should
>>> show up in your illuminance calcs though.
>>>
>>> I suggest changing the walls to gray and changing the time of day to
>>> 11:45.  Then you should see reflection patterns along the west wall of your
>>> model.
>>>
>>> Andy
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 4:32 PM, Shamim Javed <javeds2006 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> That was an aspect I had not thought about.  Thanks for the tip!  I
>>>> went back and fixed the surface normal's in my model.  It did not, however,
>>>> create the reflections I am looking for.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 6:03 PM, Andrew McNeil <amcneil at lbl.gov> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Shamim,
>>>>>
>>>>> Your ceiling surface normal is facing up (which matters for the mirror
>>>>> type).  Change polygon zone91.rad00770 to what is copied below.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also make sure that you set -dr and -lr parameters to the number of
>>>>> mirror reflections you want to have (8 or so?).
>>>>>
>>>>> Let me know if you still don't see what you are expecting.
>>>>>
>>>>> Best,
>>>>> Andy
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Morror_Ceiling polygon zone91.rad00770
>>>>> 0
>>>>> 0
>>>>> 15
>>>>>   1.21920  2.89560  7.16280
>>>>>   1.21920  21.18360  7.16280
>>>>>   10.36320  21.18360  7.16280
>>>>>   10.36320  2.89560  7.16280
>>>>>   1.21920  2.89560  7.16280
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 1:47 PM, Shamim Javed <javeds2006 at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Apologies for sending the wrong link.  Here is one that should work!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/a8e7o5mugbluqdn/GVS1vZKjNC
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Shamim.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2013 at 1:00 PM, shailan zareiy <sh.zareiy at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> hi Shamim
>>>>>>> do you assign the mirror surfaces as secondary light source? if you
>>>>>>> use ecotect for modelling, in the material assignment of this software, in
>>>>>>> the advanced export you should write this discription :
>>>>>>>  void mirror materail name
>>>>>>> 0
>>>>>>> 0
>>>>>>> 3  1 1 1
>>>>>>> does it solve the problem?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 6:45 PM, Compagnon Raphaël <
>>>>>>> Raphael.Compagnon at hefr.ch> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If all these surfaces are mirrors, then you cannot see anything....
>>>>>>>> unless:
>>>>>>>> - there is a non-mirror reflecting object somewhere in your scene
>>>>>>>> that is supoposed to be lit by the multiple-reflecting light path; since it
>>>>>>>> will reflect light in many directions you should see it!
>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> - your point of view is located somewhere on the
>>>>>>>> multiple-reflecting light path and your view direction points towards it.
>>>>>>>> Then you should directly see the light source appearing as an image on the
>>>>>>>> last mirror.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Raphaël
>>>>>>>> ________________________________
>>>>>>>> De : Shamim Javed [javeds2006 at gmail.com]
>>>>>>>> Date d'envoi : lundi 11 mars 2013 15:56
>>>>>>>> À : Radiance general discussion
>>>>>>>> Objet : Re: [Radiance-general] Light Shelf Reflections
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I am hoping to see multiple reflections of the light beam reflected
>>>>>>>> off the light shelf top surface in both the floor and the ceiling (all of
>>>>>>>> which are mirror surfaces).
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Jack de Valpine <jedev at visarc.com
>>>>>>>> <mailto:jedev at visarc.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hi Shamim,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> What changes are you expecting to see?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -Jack
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> Jack de Valpine
>>>>>>>> President
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Visarc Incorporated
>>>>>>>> www.visarc.com<http://www.visarc.com>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> channeling technology for superior design and construction
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 3/11/2013 10:03 AM, Shamim Javed wrote:
>>>>>>>> I am using Radiance via Ecotect.  I have played around with
>>>>>>>> changing the values for -dr, -av and -ab without seeing any change in the
>>>>>>>> image output.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Mon, Mar 11, 2013 at 9:20 AM, Christopher Rush <
>>>>>>>> Christopher.Rush at arup.com<mailto:Christopher.Rush at arup.com>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> Are you using the default parameters for rpict/rtrace? Have you
>>>>>>>> tried setting the -dr parameter greater than 2? If you post the command you
>>>>>>>> are using to calculate the reflections, it may be easier to comment. I
>>>>>>>> suspect it will be more complicated than the -dr setting, but that's a
>>>>>>>> start.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> >  I have been unsuccessful, so far, to generate  more than two
>>>>>>>> reflections.
>>>>>>>>
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